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	<title>Comments on: Everything You Need To Know, In Order &#8211; Part II</title>
	<atom:link href="http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/</link>
	<description>Finding the keys to the future…and trying not to lose them in the mess.</description>
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		<title>By: Online jobs work from home</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-44987</link>
		<dc:creator>Online jobs work from home</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2011 09:11:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-44987</guid>
		<description>Hello, i think that i saw you visited my weblog thus i came to “return the favor”.I am trying to find things to improve my website!I suppose its ok to use a few of your ideas!!
____________________
&lt;a href=&quot;http://onlineincometips.info/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Online extra income&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello, i think that i saw you visited my weblog thus i came to “return the favor”.I am trying to find things to improve my website!I suppose its ok to use a few of your ideas!!<br />
____________________<br />
<a href="http://onlineincometips.info/" rel="nofollow">Online extra income</a></p>
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		<title>By: Central_PA_Chris</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7345</link>
		<dc:creator>Central_PA_Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 21:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7345</guid>
		<description>My story in a nut shell: I&#039;m not a city folk. Grew up in suburbia in the middle class, maybe upper middle by the time I headed to college in &#039;90. Had lots of outdoor time and experience, fishing, camping, hiking, and toting along with mom and her copy of &quot;Stalking the Wild Asparagus&quot; on my grandparents 14 acre cabin property that backed up on a pile of public land in NE PA. So grew up playing in the dirt, catching snakes, turtles and the occasional sumac lemonade. Dad was a manager, responsible, analytical, strong, and had a strong personal responsibility ethic. So I got a does of outdoors, work ethic, enough brains to keep me alive and a world view that things change and that&#039;s not always good for people/civilization.

I think it was in high school in the late 80&#039;s that I started to realize that the culture around me was not sustainable (though I doubt I could have articulated that thought quite that succinctly). That unease, sense of something wrong coalesced into the conclusion that we are so far separated from the consequences of our actions and choices that we have abdicated most of the responsibility, cost and pain of those choices and actions from them. i believe that the bill eventually comes due. Peak oil is one symptom of that, but I think it&#039;s much deeper and more disturbing than Peak Oil (as if that isn&#039;t disturbing enough).

Went to college at Penn State, graduated, worked with wildlife, started a small consulting business. Bought a house in small town PA on .5 acre, got married, got divorced, cashed out of the house and that part of my life for a larger chunk of land. Been shaping that, subdivided a couple 12 acre parcels off to pay off the land and development costs (wish me luck on selling those in the current housing market), almost have the pole building workshop &amp; office building done, setting up a yurt as bedroom for the fall/winter. With some land sales luck I&#039;m hoping to get out of debt, dig some ponds, enlarge the orchard and maybe, just maybe get around to building a house, but when I weigh ponds vs house, ponds come first, heck solar panels might come first on the office/workshop.

I believe in peak oil, (and global warming, soil depletion, fish stock depletion and many other bad, bad things) did lots of reading starting with Mr Savinar&#039;s bleak outlook on the future, followed the trail from there. My path lead me to numbers of drill rigs, individual country profiles and production curves, read many books and a few papers and all the online info I could get.  Change is inevitable and it certainly seems the bill is coming due soon for many, many sins, externalities which have gone unpaid, and debts incurred. I&#039;d guess it&#039;s about 20% chance of a big fast crash, but more than likely it will be slower, a downward economic cycle leading to depression opposed to the implosion seen by Savinar/Kuntzler. I&#039;m not one to think the lights are going out in the next year, but I do think keeping them on is going to be much more expensive as we move forward. My particular preparations for things slowing down are to spend $ on good insulation, geothermal heating (low energy usage and can use energy at night off peak to heat), big workshop (wood and metal) and trying to pay off/stay out of debt.

I like growing things, but my work busy season is summer and I travel for months on end, so I&#039;m into season extending tactics/low maintenance edible landscaping. A combination of tactics from &quot;square foot gardening&quot; and &quot;solar gardening&quot; suits my lifestyle and time as I work on larger landscape projects/orchards and working to pay the bills.

This particular site is one I&#039;m attracted to because Sharon&#039;s writing is great and it&#039;s not just doom and gloom. It&#039;s doom and gloom with useful tips and discussion about things that I had NOT thought about or read about elsewhere.

That&#039;s me,
Chris

P.S. It would be nice if the site let us edit our posts. It&#039;s always easy to find word choice/grammar etc when re-reading a day later.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My story in a nut shell: I&#8217;m not a city folk. Grew up in suburbia in the middle class, maybe upper middle by the time I headed to college in &#8217;90. Had lots of outdoor time and experience, fishing, camping, hiking, and toting along with mom and her copy of &#8220;Stalking the Wild Asparagus&#8221; on my grandparents 14 acre cabin property that backed up on a pile of public land in NE PA. So grew up playing in the dirt, catching snakes, turtles and the occasional sumac lemonade. Dad was a manager, responsible, analytical, strong, and had a strong personal responsibility ethic. So I got a does of outdoors, work ethic, enough brains to keep me alive and a world view that things change and that&#8217;s not always good for people/civilization.</p>
<p>I think it was in high school in the late 80&#8242;s that I started to realize that the culture around me was not sustainable (though I doubt I could have articulated that thought quite that succinctly). That unease, sense of something wrong coalesced into the conclusion that we are so far separated from the consequences of our actions and choices that we have abdicated most of the responsibility, cost and pain of those choices and actions from them. i believe that the bill eventually comes due. Peak oil is one symptom of that, but I think it&#8217;s much deeper and more disturbing than Peak Oil (as if that isn&#8217;t disturbing enough).</p>
<p>Went to college at Penn State, graduated, worked with wildlife, started a small consulting business. Bought a house in small town PA on .5 acre, got married, got divorced, cashed out of the house and that part of my life for a larger chunk of land. Been shaping that, subdivided a couple 12 acre parcels off to pay off the land and development costs (wish me luck on selling those in the current housing market), almost have the pole building workshop &amp; office building done, setting up a yurt as bedroom for the fall/winter. With some land sales luck I&#8217;m hoping to get out of debt, dig some ponds, enlarge the orchard and maybe, just maybe get around to building a house, but when I weigh ponds vs house, ponds come first, heck solar panels might come first on the office/workshop.</p>
<p>I believe in peak oil, (and global warming, soil depletion, fish stock depletion and many other bad, bad things) did lots of reading starting with Mr Savinar&#8217;s bleak outlook on the future, followed the trail from there. My path lead me to numbers of drill rigs, individual country profiles and production curves, read many books and a few papers and all the online info I could get.  Change is inevitable and it certainly seems the bill is coming due soon for many, many sins, externalities which have gone unpaid, and debts incurred. I&#8217;d guess it&#8217;s about 20% chance of a big fast crash, but more than likely it will be slower, a downward economic cycle leading to depression opposed to the implosion seen by Savinar/Kuntzler. I&#8217;m not one to think the lights are going out in the next year, but I do think keeping them on is going to be much more expensive as we move forward. My particular preparations for things slowing down are to spend $ on good insulation, geothermal heating (low energy usage and can use energy at night off peak to heat), big workshop (wood and metal) and trying to pay off/stay out of debt.</p>
<p>I like growing things, but my work busy season is summer and I travel for months on end, so I&#8217;m into season extending tactics/low maintenance edible landscaping. A combination of tactics from &#8220;square foot gardening&#8221; and &#8220;solar gardening&#8221; suits my lifestyle and time as I work on larger landscape projects/orchards and working to pay the bills.</p>
<p>This particular site is one I&#8217;m attracted to because Sharon&#8217;s writing is great and it&#8217;s not just doom and gloom. It&#8217;s doom and gloom with useful tips and discussion about things that I had NOT thought about or read about elsewhere.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s me,<br />
Chris</p>
<p>P.S. It would be nice if the site let us edit our posts. It&#8217;s always easy to find word choice/grammar etc when re-reading a day later.</p>
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		<title>By: Orchid</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7344</link>
		<dc:creator>Orchid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:39:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7344</guid>
		<description>FINALLY! something on the prep list that I already know how to do well--
and post menopause no pregnancy risk to worry about ;)

With the unprecedented privacy in the large US homes, it seems likely to me that kids are less aware of their parents sexuality than every before-- and more likely to be exposed to a unrealistic models on television and the internet.

My best friend grew up in a very small house with seven siblings. She (jokingly) claims to still be traumatized from catching her parents in the act but she knows where she and each of  her brothers and sisters were conceived and sex was not a dirty word in her family.

Maybe as our spaces shrink, kids will grow up with a more balanced view of sex.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FINALLY! something on the prep list that I already know how to do well&#8211;<br />
and post menopause no pregnancy risk to worry about <img src='http://sharonastyk.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>With the unprecedented privacy in the large US homes, it seems likely to me that kids are less aware of their parents sexuality than every before&#8211; and more likely to be exposed to a unrealistic models on television and the internet.</p>
<p>My best friend grew up in a very small house with seven siblings. She (jokingly) claims to still be traumatized from catching her parents in the act but she knows where she and each of  her brothers and sisters were conceived and sex was not a dirty word in her family.</p>
<p>Maybe as our spaces shrink, kids will grow up with a more balanced view of sex.</p>
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		<title>By: Sara</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7343</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7343</guid>
		<description>Greetings

Everyone has a valid point to make and none of us have our thoughts completely worked out perfectly when we respond. Yet each of us can pause and re-read our replys to be sure we are kind.

We can express our thoughts and disagree politely, with kindness.

It will take all we have in strength and fortitude to be people that can help one another in this *transition* or Long Emergency.

Let us begin now.

Sara, Alabama</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greetings</p>
<p>Everyone has a valid point to make and none of us have our thoughts completely worked out perfectly when we respond. Yet each of us can pause and re-read our replys to be sure we are kind.</p>
<p>We can express our thoughts and disagree politely, with kindness.</p>
<p>It will take all we have in strength and fortitude to be people that can help one another in this *transition* or Long Emergency.</p>
<p>Let us begin now.</p>
<p>Sara, Alabama</p>
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		<title>By: Jade</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7342</link>
		<dc:creator>Jade</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jul 2008 03:00:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7342</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m interested, Chris.  I enjoyed your spot-on comment above!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m interested, Chris.  I enjoyed your spot-on comment above!</p>
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		<title>By: Central_PA_Chris</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7341</link>
		<dc:creator>Central_PA_Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jul 2008 02:10:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7341</guid>
		<description>&quot;I just wanted to get out my main point–that we have seen an era of excess in that area, and eventually all things return to the mean.&quot;

Really? Look at the native populations decimated by syphilis (and other STD&#039;s) spread by travelers/traders/conquistadores/missionaries. Look at the nature of mankind, look at ancent art, look at STD rates in civilized cultures in eras past, look at historical birth rates. I&#039;m not sure you are right that there had been a greater era of sexuality in the past 50 or so years of oil boom. I&#039;m sure many modern (and ancient) religions thrive(d) by painting the current era as one of immorality to separate the saved from the sinners, but I&#039;m not sure our current crop of sinners is more wicked now than 100 or 1000 or 5000 years ago.

If there really was a era of peak sexuality, I&#039;d bet that giving women basic rights has had more effect on that development than oil. Though one could argue that it was cheap abundant energy that got us barbaric men to cede those basic and vital rights to women as they were of more value out and about in society and working that chained to a wood stove. In an era of reduced energy we are likely to see freedoms of both men and women shrink, totalitarian governments arise out of democracies and possibly women loosing some of their hard earned rights. No sir, I will not drink or celebrate the return to a more virginal era at that cost.

Hello all, I&#039;m a semi-long time reader, first time poster. Is it polite to post a bit about myself/introduce myself and why/how I ended up trolling peak oil/energy slowdown sites and why I have gravitated to this one in particular?

Have a good weekend,
Chris</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I just wanted to get out my main point–that we have seen an era of excess in that area, and eventually all things return to the mean.&#8221;</p>
<p>Really? Look at the native populations decimated by syphilis (and other STD&#8217;s) spread by travelers/traders/conquistadores/missionaries. Look at the nature of mankind, look at ancent art, look at STD rates in civilized cultures in eras past, look at historical birth rates. I&#8217;m not sure you are right that there had been a greater era of sexuality in the past 50 or so years of oil boom. I&#8217;m sure many modern (and ancient) religions thrive(d) by painting the current era as one of immorality to separate the saved from the sinners, but I&#8217;m not sure our current crop of sinners is more wicked now than 100 or 1000 or 5000 years ago.</p>
<p>If there really was a era of peak sexuality, I&#8217;d bet that giving women basic rights has had more effect on that development than oil. Though one could argue that it was cheap abundant energy that got us barbaric men to cede those basic and vital rights to women as they were of more value out and about in society and working that chained to a wood stove. In an era of reduced energy we are likely to see freedoms of both men and women shrink, totalitarian governments arise out of democracies and possibly women loosing some of their hard earned rights. No sir, I will not drink or celebrate the return to a more virginal era at that cost.</p>
<p>Hello all, I&#8217;m a semi-long time reader, first time poster. Is it polite to post a bit about myself/introduce myself and why/how I ended up trolling peak oil/energy slowdown sites and why I have gravitated to this one in particular?</p>
<p>Have a good weekend,<br />
Chris</p>
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		<title>By: caelids</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7340</link>
		<dc:creator>caelids</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 19:44:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7340</guid>
		<description>I stand by what I said.  Perhaps I didn&#039;t qualify enough--

1.  I&#039;m not suggesting we go back to the past, even if the &quot;past&quot; could be defined and standardized and somehow &quot;enforced.&quot;

2.  I&#039;m not suggesting that injustices against women that were endemic in those societies are warranted or excusable in any way.

3.  I&#039;m not suggesting that it&#039;s bad to educate your children about their sexuality and the proper way to handle it.

Let&#039;s not let this take over the discussion. I know this is not Sharon&#039;s main point.

I just wanted to get out my main point--that we have seen an era of excess in that area, and eventually all things return to the mean.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I stand by what I said.  Perhaps I didn&#8217;t qualify enough&#8211;</p>
<p>1.  I&#8217;m not suggesting we go back to the past, even if the &#8220;past&#8221; could be defined and standardized and somehow &#8220;enforced.&#8221;</p>
<p>2.  I&#8217;m not suggesting that injustices against women that were endemic in those societies are warranted or excusable in any way.</p>
<p>3.  I&#8217;m not suggesting that it&#8217;s bad to educate your children about their sexuality and the proper way to handle it.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s not let this take over the discussion. I know this is not Sharon&#8217;s main point.</p>
<p>I just wanted to get out my main point&#8211;that we have seen an era of excess in that area, and eventually all things return to the mean.</p>
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		<title>By: MEA</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7339</link>
		<dc:creator>MEA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 15:09:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7339</guid>
		<description>My understand is that in the good old day (in Europe) the problem for society wasn&#039;t that it was bad for teensage girls to have children -- it was bad for them to have with teen age boys who couldn&#039;t marry or support the them and the offspring.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My understand is that in the good old day (in Europe) the problem for society wasn&#8217;t that it was bad for teensage girls to have children &#8212; it was bad for them to have with teen age boys who couldn&#8217;t marry or support the them and the offspring.</p>
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		<title>By: Sharon</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7338</link>
		<dc:creator>Sharon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 13:14:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7338</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m going to broadly agree with Rebekka and MEA here - and while I didn&#039;t literally mean &quot;teaching them how to have sex - I mean who wants to learn that from their parents - I was being cute, and meant &quot;about sex and its issues&quot; the truth is that societies have organized sexual relationships in many complicated ways for centuries - for example, in 17th century Germany, people didn&#039;t marry until well into their 20s, but almost all brides were pregnant at the time of marriage - because betrothal was legally as binding as marriage.  In some Native American societies, girls were allowed sexual freedom as soon as they were old enough, and if the partnership didn&#039;t work, the child was raised by the tribe and extended family.  In some medieval European societies, girls of the upper class married in their early teens - certainly, however, sexual experimentation had consequences - it always does.

All the evidence suggests that open discussion of sex and sexuality is far more effective than abstinence education.  A recent study, for example, showed that those trained in abstinence were no less likely to get pregnant, and were more likely to have anal sex, oral sex and contract STDs.  The evidence on abstinence training is in, and it doesn&#039;t work.

The sexual mores of the future are going to be complex and different from today, and social pressures are probably going to play an important role.  But they are more complicated that simply putting in a quarter and getting out a particular result.

Sharon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to broadly agree with Rebekka and MEA here &#8211; and while I didn&#8217;t literally mean &#8220;teaching them how to have sex &#8211; I mean who wants to learn that from their parents &#8211; I was being cute, and meant &#8220;about sex and its issues&#8221; the truth is that societies have organized sexual relationships in many complicated ways for centuries &#8211; for example, in 17th century Germany, people didn&#8217;t marry until well into their 20s, but almost all brides were pregnant at the time of marriage &#8211; because betrothal was legally as binding as marriage.  In some Native American societies, girls were allowed sexual freedom as soon as they were old enough, and if the partnership didn&#8217;t work, the child was raised by the tribe and extended family.  In some medieval European societies, girls of the upper class married in their early teens &#8211; certainly, however, sexual experimentation had consequences &#8211; it always does.</p>
<p>All the evidence suggests that open discussion of sex and sexuality is far more effective than abstinence education.  A recent study, for example, showed that those trained in abstinence were no less likely to get pregnant, and were more likely to have anal sex, oral sex and contract STDs.  The evidence on abstinence training is in, and it doesn&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>The sexual mores of the future are going to be complex and different from today, and social pressures are probably going to play an important role.  But they are more complicated that simply putting in a quarter and getting out a particular result.</p>
<p>Sharon</p>
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		<title>By: MEA</title>
		<link>http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-7337</link>
		<dc:creator>MEA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 12:38:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sharonastyk.com/2008/07/24/everything-you-need-to-know-in-order-part-ii/#comment-7337</guid>
		<description>I agree with the above.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the above.</p>
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