Comments on: Why Buy the Cow When I'm Giving Milk Away for Free? The Problem of Newspapers http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/ Finding the keys to the future…and trying not to lose them in the mess. Thu, 24 May 2012 04:38:10 -0700 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Wilber Mceuen http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-82184 Wilber Mceuen Sat, 10 Dec 2011 16:16:42 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-82184 Brilliant post thank you! - You really gave me some new ideas and I'll certainly be bookmarking your site and recommending it to my friends. Do you have a newsletter that I could subscribe to in order to find out more? Thanks again and keep up the good work! Brilliant post thank you! – You really gave me some new ideas and I’ll certainly be bookmarking your site and recommending it to my friends. Do you have a newsletter that I could subscribe to in order to find out more? Thanks again and keep up the good work!

]]> By: Mae Thiede http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-40275 Mae Thiede Mon, 02 May 2011 06:53:02 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-40275 Thanks a ton for being my instructor on this subject matter. I actually enjoyed your own article greatly and most of all preferred how you handled the issues I regarded as being controversial. You are always incredibly kind to readers really like me and aid me in my lifestyle. Thank you. Thanks a ton for being my instructor on this subject matter. I actually enjoyed your own article greatly and most of all preferred how you handled the issues I regarded as being controversial. You are always incredibly kind to readers really like me and aid me in my lifestyle. Thank you.

]]> By: Eliseo Athan http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-29166 Eliseo Athan Sun, 24 Oct 2010 00:17:08 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-29166 I have come to the conclusion that this post and supporting comments are very fascinating. To my knowledge, this is a great website to hunt down articles on issues such as natural health. Will anyone here show me where to find more detailed information on this topic, though? Thanks in advance! I have come to the conclusion that this post and supporting comments are very fascinating. To my knowledge, this is a great website to hunt down articles on issues such as natural health. Will anyone here show me where to find more detailed information on this topic, though? Thanks in advance!

]]> By: Lined & Unlined » Blog Archive » » 502 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12597 Lined & Unlined » Blog Archive » » 502 Mon, 02 Feb 2009 14:38:57 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12597 [...] recommends you read this article on newspapers, gift economies, bloggers, and the problem of “free.” 02 February [...] [...] recommends you read this article on newspapers, gift economies, bloggers, and the problem of “free.” 02 February [...]

]]> By: edde http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12596 edde Thu, 01 Jan 2009 14:51:45 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12596 Hi Sharon, Good piece. If we look at who owns newspapers and what return they expect on their investments, we see an underlying problem. Many papers are owned by national syndicates and investment groups that expect massive profits, in the 20% range, I've read. Inadequate journalism comes directly from that emphasis on the bottom line - too much money returns to investors rather than being spent on coverage. Yet democracy requires an informed electorate. Most of my neighbors are not on the internet, don't own computers. How do we, my neighbors and I, get information critical to good decisions? I, too, participated in underground newspapers. Also helped found a local weekly, now defunct. Both are sort of proto-blogosphere, yet still relevant to computer nonparticipants Money for writing, photography, art, layout and printing was in short supply but once a reasonable readership threshold was reached (around 10k readers), survival money could be earned. Not big profits, but enough to offset journalists' expenses, some small payment for effort. Frugal "small is beautiful" jurnalist types could make a reasonable living. My sense is that what is needed is a local "free" news weekly, widely distributed in the community, supplemented by online daily coverage, blogs, readers' comment & contributions. It can be funded by local businesses, subscriptions and such. If the paper were collectively owned by its participants, writers, business managers, subscribers and business sustainers, it might make a go of it, even in this downsizing economy. Of course, it would need to provide good coverage of important issues, both local and from the wider world, and provide useful commentary. It should provide practical info, do-it-yourself pieces, and such. And provide useful advertising services to local small business. It needs to be committed to small "d" democracy, based in truth, free of status quo bias and unfettered by any of its constituencies' demands other than the public's need to know. Wouldn't hurt to have a good comic section, excellent writing, lots of photos & art, coverage of local culture & participant sports and make sense. What is amazing, that when the initiating call goes out in a community bereft of a decent local paper, many people are willing to help. High school & college journalism classes can be invaluable, particularly teachers. Activist community usually throw in... I guess I better get up off it and get to work, eh. Stay tuned. edde Hi Sharon,

Good piece.

If we look at who owns newspapers and what return they expect on their investments, we see an underlying problem. Many papers are owned by national syndicates and investment groups that expect massive profits, in the 20% range, I’ve read.

Inadequate journalism comes directly from that emphasis on the bottom line – too much money returns to investors rather than being spent on coverage.

Yet democracy requires an informed electorate. Most of my neighbors are not on the internet, don’t own computers. How do we, my neighbors and I, get information critical to good decisions?

I, too, participated in underground newspapers. Also helped found a local weekly, now defunct. Both are sort of proto-blogosphere, yet still relevant to computer nonparticipants

Money for writing, photography, art, layout and printing was in short supply but once a reasonable readership threshold was reached (around 10k readers), survival money could be earned. Not big profits, but enough to offset journalists’ expenses, some small payment for effort.

Frugal “small is beautiful” jurnalist types could make a reasonable living.

My sense is that what is needed is a local “free” news weekly, widely distributed in the community, supplemented by online daily coverage, blogs, readers’ comment & contributions. It can be funded by local businesses, subscriptions and such. If the paper were collectively owned by its participants, writers, business managers, subscribers and business sustainers, it might make a go of it, even in this downsizing economy.

Of course, it would need to provide good coverage of important issues, both local and from the wider world, and provide useful commentary. It should provide practical info, do-it-yourself pieces, and such. And provide useful advertising services to local small business.

It needs to be committed to small “d” democracy, based in truth, free of status quo bias and unfettered by any of its constituencies’ demands other than the public’s need to know.

Wouldn’t hurt to have a good comic section, excellent writing, lots of photos & art, coverage of local culture & participant sports and make sense.

What is amazing, that when the initiating call goes out in a community bereft of a decent local paper, many people are willing to help. High school & college journalism classes can be invaluable, particularly teachers. Activist community usually throw in…

I guess I better get up off it and get to work, eh. Stay tuned.

edde

]]> By: Anna Synick http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12595 Anna Synick Thu, 01 Jan 2009 04:55:47 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12595 Having my own cow and giving away the milk I have left over (after what we need ourselves and what I use to make cheese and yoghurt) I think the hardest is to get your own head around the change in mindset for the new future we are facing. I was told in the beginning I should sell the milk to cover the cost of keeping my cow, but I found that people around me simply are not yet ready to pay money for goods that they can get in the supermarket. I firmly believe this will change in the not too distant future and then perhaps also the view of not valuing yourself when you give foods away will change as well. Admittedly I now only give my milk to people who do really appreciate it and love the taste of real milk, not just to anyone. The fact that they are happy receiving the milk and love drinking it is a show of appreciation and valuing my efforts of handmilking in itself as well. I now don't see it as giving stuff away for free - I simply see it as not letting my extra milk go to waste and pouring it away as I know some others do. The whole money earning concept will change as money will start losing its value - this will be a big change to get used to for all of us I'm sure. Having my own cow and giving away the milk I have left over (after what we need ourselves and what I use to make cheese and yoghurt) I think the hardest is to get your own head around the change in mindset for the new future we are facing. I was told in the beginning I should sell the milk to cover the cost of keeping my cow, but I found that people around me simply are not yet ready to pay money for goods that they can get in the supermarket. I firmly believe this will change in the not too distant future and then perhaps also the view of not valuing yourself when you give foods away will change as well. Admittedly I now only give my milk to people who do really appreciate it and love the taste of real milk, not just to anyone. The fact that they are happy receiving the milk and love drinking it is a show of appreciation and valuing my efforts of handmilking in itself as well. I now don’t see it as giving stuff away for free – I simply see it as not letting my extra milk go to waste and pouring it away as I know some others do. The whole money earning concept will change as money will start losing its value – this will be a big change to get used to for all of us I’m sure.

]]> By: dewey http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12594 dewey Wed, 31 Dec 2008 17:47:21 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12594 Not all bloggers pretend to be above the financial motive. Ilargi over at Automatic Earth, who is today touting your support, is becoming an increasingly aggressive panhandler. Today he writes: "We have managed to save a lot of you a lot of money, for instance by telling you to get the hell out of the stock markets. The flipside of that is that we have undoubtedly saved you -combined- millions of dollars, whereas our Christmas fundraiser so far is stuck well below $10.000. There is something wrong in that." Well, since I do not have money to play with stocks - and would not take it out of the market on his say-so if I did, as proven by the fact that I continue to contribute to my meager retirement fund - he hasn't saved me anything. And it is convenient to read financial news copied on his site rather than going to multiple individual sources, but this is not a service for which I would pay much, especially since the original sources are also online and are free. If he wants to parlay his blog into profit, perhaps he should start a subscription newsletter which could be marketed to his current fans, or follow your lead and write a book if he has the expertise and interest to do so. It is not reasonable to hope that most web users will pay for access to the opinions of an anonymous person of unknown qualifications. Not all bloggers pretend to be above the financial motive. Ilargi over at Automatic Earth, who is today touting your support, is becoming an increasingly aggressive panhandler. Today he writes: “We have managed to save a lot of you a lot of money, for instance by telling you to get the hell out of the stock markets. The flipside of that is that we have undoubtedly saved you -combined- millions of dollars, whereas our Christmas fundraiser so far is stuck well below $10.000. There is something wrong in that.”

Well, since I do not have money to play with stocks – and would not take it out of the market on his say-so if I did, as proven by the fact that I continue to contribute to my meager retirement fund – he hasn’t saved me anything. And it is convenient to read financial news copied on his site rather than going to multiple individual sources, but this is not a service for which I would pay much, especially since the original sources are also online and are free. If he wants to parlay his blog into profit, perhaps he should start a subscription newsletter which could be marketed to his current fans, or follow your lead and write a book if he has the expertise and interest to do so. It is not reasonable to hope that most web users will pay for access to the opinions of an anonymous person of unknown qualifications.

]]> By: greentangle http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12593 greentangle Wed, 31 Dec 2008 17:33:36 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12593 “How little respect do you have for yourself to give away your work for free.” How indicative of someone who asks, "What's in it for me?" and who views life as an individualistic race instead of as a group journey. “How little respect do you have for yourself to give away your work for free.”

How indicative of someone who asks, “What’s in it for me?” and who views life as an individualistic race instead of as a group journey.

]]> By: Greenpa http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12592 Greenpa Wed, 31 Dec 2008 17:23:43 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12592 Having given away most of my work, for most of my life, I am familiar with that problem. It's really pretty complex, as you clearly see. My reasons include the fact that a good deal of my professional work was so far out there that no one was ever going to pay me for it- there was no other way to get it done. There is a long-term downside though, which I don't see mentioned here. (Besides the fact that you tend to wind up broke, like me.) "The World" makes quick judgments about your personal worth- based on what others have been willing to pay for your skills. After 30 years, I have a small number of people who know what my expertise is truly worth. And a vastly larger number who consider my input- worthless. Hey, nobody has ever paid me for it- so- Granted- the QUALITY of those who know me is extremely high- and the general quality of those who do not value my skills is questionable- still, in terms of getting projects accomplished, the assessment of the majority is useful, and important. Long discussions possible. Anyway- here's a question to keep in mind; is what you are doing of real value to society? Society is willing to pay those who make real contributions; cheerfully. Nurses, doctors, cops- mostly we don't begrudge their support from the community. It CAN make you more effective- if you can add the fact that somebody thinks what you do is so important; gosh, they pay you for it. Having given away most of my work, for most of my life, I am familiar with that problem.

It’s really pretty complex, as you clearly see. My reasons include the fact that a good deal of my professional work was so far out there that no one was ever going to pay me for it- there was no other way to get it done.

There is a long-term downside though, which I don’t see mentioned here. (Besides the fact that you tend to wind up broke, like me.)

“The World” makes quick judgments about your personal worth- based on what others have been willing to pay for your skills.

After 30 years, I have a small number of people who know what my expertise is truly worth. And a vastly larger number who consider my input- worthless. Hey, nobody has ever paid me for it- so-

Granted- the QUALITY of those who know me is extremely high- and the general quality of those who do not value my skills is questionable- still, in terms of getting projects accomplished, the assessment of the majority is useful, and important.

Long discussions possible. Anyway- here’s a question to keep in mind; is what you are doing of real value to society? Society is willing to pay those who make real contributions; cheerfully. Nurses, doctors, cops- mostly we don’t begrudge their support from the community.

It CAN make you more effective- if you can add the fact that somebody thinks what you do is so important; gosh, they pay you for it.

]]> By: Carol http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/comment-page-1/#comment-12591 Carol Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:58:27 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2008/12/30/why-buy-the-cow-when-im-giving-milk-away-for-free-the-problem-of-newspapers/#comment-12591 I don't trust the paid media. Haven't for years. I do listen to Bloomberg and read online newspapers, especially when cited by bloggers. However, I do not believe much of what the paid media says, simply because its effect, regardless of intent, is to reinforce the status quo ideas, like Growth is Essential and It Must Go On Forever Or We Will All Die, and other such nonsense. But what do you expect, they've got to earn their money. I don’t trust the paid media. Haven’t for years. I do listen to Bloomberg and read online newspapers, especially when cited by bloggers. However, I do not believe much of what the paid media says, simply because its effect, regardless of intent, is to reinforce the status quo ideas, like Growth is Essential and It Must Go On Forever Or We Will All Die, and other such nonsense. But what do you expect, they’ve got to earn their money.

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