Comments on: Fertile Inquiries - Creating and Sustaining Soil Fertility http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/ Sharon Astyk's Ruminations on an Ambiguous Future Mon, 02 Mar 2009 20:56:39 +0000 #?v=2.3.2 By: Apple Jack Creek http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17824 Apple Jack Creek Wed, 25 Feb 2009 02:36:44 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17824 Oh, your link to the lasagne gardening site is EXACTLY what I needed! I have a nice garden on reasonable soil, but it's former pasture and the grass is *very* well established. Last year I put in two raised beds, filled with purchased peat moss and planting mix and grew a decent crop of stuff. This year I want to expand, and was thinking with dread of having to go out there and dig up the soil, turn over the sod, and find the dirt underneath. You've saved me! I can lay down newspaper (time to start asking people to save me some), and I have a two (three?) year old bale of hay sitting in there that is just waiting to be rolled out on top of everything. In fact, last year I rolled some of it out on areas I planned to plant in future, to kill the grass and compost in place ... so apparently I was on the right track. :) We do have animal manure (sheep and a couple of cows) and a nice big compost pile going from last year's barnyard waste, so with luck, we'll be able to get those new beds in place without me needing daily visits to the chiropractor! Thanks! Oh, your link to the lasagne gardening site is EXACTLY what I needed!

I have a nice garden on reasonable soil, but it’s former pasture and the grass is *very* well established. Last year I put in two raised beds, filled with purchased peat moss and planting mix and grew a decent crop of stuff.

This year I want to expand, and was thinking with dread of having to go out there and dig up the soil, turn over the sod, and find the dirt underneath. You’ve saved me! I can lay down newspaper (time to start asking people to save me some), and I have a two (three?) year old bale of hay sitting in there that is just waiting to be rolled out on top of everything. In fact, last year I rolled some of it out on areas I planned to plant in future, to kill the grass and compost in place … so apparently I was on the right track. :)

We do have animal manure (sheep and a couple of cows) and a nice big compost pile going from last year’s barnyard waste, so with luck, we’ll be able to get those new beds in place without me needing daily visits to the chiropractor!

Thanks!

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By: TJ http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17817 TJ Wed, 25 Feb 2009 00:16:04 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17817 we have a worm bin, but not a compost pile (we used to but - rats...) so what to do with a little piece of bread that got moldy, and today a can of cod liver that looked bloated ? Tell me if this is VERY wrong - I bury it all - under trees and where ever I can dig 6" without destroying too many roots. I don't exactly know who will consume the bad cod liver and its associated botulism. But something did consume a chicken carcass - nothing left after only a month. May be the gophers, may be raccoons may be something else - but whatever ate the stuff - must poop too. So all the organic matter goes - the only problem is all I have is 5000 sq. ft that includes the house and the drive way etc. TJ we have a worm bin, but not a compost pile (we used to but - rats…)
so what to do with a little piece of bread that got moldy, and today a can of cod liver that looked bloated ?
Tell me if this is VERY wrong - I bury it all - under trees and where ever I can dig 6″ without destroying too many roots. I don’t exactly know who will consume the bad cod liver and its associated botulism. But something did consume a chicken carcass - nothing left after only a month. May be the gophers, may be raccoons may be something else - but whatever ate the stuff - must poop too. So all the organic matter goes - the only problem is all I have is 5000 sq. ft that includes the house and the drive way etc.

TJ

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By: Maeve http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17811 Maeve Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:48:34 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17811 My soil is moderately healthy (as in, plenty of worms), and more sandy than clay, though definitely lacking in loam. My long-term goal is to get that rich black earth thing going on. Adding in compost, organic fertilizers, and some mulch are all on my game plan. I just don't want to disrupt the mini ecosystem too much all at once, and I would be really disappointed if my efforts at garden fertility eliminated all the random flower volunteers that popped up last year. (At one time there had been a garden there, but it was grassed in, so I had to dig out the sod last spring in order to plant. I had Johnny Jump-ups pop up all over the place. Simply lovely.) I used to have a source for horse manure (alas, I had no garden then), but they have since given up their horses. So I'm keeping an eye out for animal inputs. My soil is moderately healthy (as in, plenty of worms), and more sandy than clay, though definitely lacking in loam. My long-term goal is to get that rich black earth thing going on.

Adding in compost, organic fertilizers, and some mulch are all on my game plan. I just don’t want to disrupt the mini ecosystem too much all at once, and I would be really disappointed if my efforts at garden fertility eliminated all the random flower volunteers that popped up last year. (At one time there had been a garden there, but it was grassed in, so I had to dig out the sod last spring in order to plant. I had Johnny Jump-ups pop up all over the place. Simply lovely.)

I used to have a source for horse manure (alas, I had no garden then), but they have since given up their horses. So I’m keeping an eye out for animal inputs.

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By: Fern http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17809 Fern Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:40:46 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17809 Ct - check with your county farm extension office. Lance - we have lovely chipmunks here, aerating away (and entertaining our indoor cats). They are great fun. Sharon - I've got the 'mulch and some soil' on top of hard hard hard clay going in one of my beds. Didn't produce much last year, but it has VERY happy dandelions overwintering. Fern Ct - check with your county farm extension office.

Lance - we have lovely chipmunks here, aerating away (and entertaining our indoor cats). They are great fun.

Sharon - I’ve got the ‘mulch and some soil’ on top of hard hard hard clay going in one of my beds. Didn’t produce much last year, but it has VERY happy dandelions overwintering.

Fern

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By: ctdaffodil http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17808 ctdaffodil Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:32:29 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17808 ok - I'm going to go ahead and ask - Where is the best place to get a soil sample tested.....since I won't get raised beds done for my gardening this year - I guess I should have my soil tested before getting a delivery of composted manure and tilling it under...... ok - I’m going to go ahead and ask -
Where is the best place to get a soil sample tested…..since I won’t get raised beds done for my gardening this year - I guess I should have my soil tested before getting a delivery of composted manure and tilling it under……

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By: Lance http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17807 Lance Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:31:23 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17807 more from the same site: "We don't have gophers, but we do have moles. And what a blessing they are! One resident at the farm said he wanted to get more cats so that they could get rid of the moles. I explained what a loss that would be, given that the moles aerate and turn-over the soil masterfully. Also, the soil of the mole hills the make are excellent soil to put on top of our raised beds! Its already mixed, and fluffed too. I filled several 10 gallon buckets with soil from only about 1/2 the molehills on the farm. I did not want to hog it all. Also, I make sure that there is enough soil left that their burrow entrance is covered so that I don't expose them to predators. You can do the same thing with gopher hills. Moles are awesome!" more from the same site:

“We don’t have gophers, but we do have moles. And what a blessing they are! One resident at the farm said he wanted to get more cats so that they could get rid of the moles. I explained what a loss that would be, given that the moles aerate and turn-over the soil masterfully. Also, the soil of the mole hills the make are excellent soil to put on top of our raised beds! Its already mixed, and fluffed too.
I filled several 10 gallon buckets with soil from only about 1/2 the molehills on the farm. I did not want to hog it all. Also, I make sure that there is enough soil left that their burrow entrance is covered so that I don’t expose them to predators.

You can do the same thing with gopher hills.

Moles are awesome!”

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By: Lance http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17806 Lance Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:29:05 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17806 Ethical Gardening from an Animist Standpoint: http://tribes.tribe.net/bioregionalanimism/thread/119f7075-4722-4b41-84f7-4236ebadb9fa "The idea took a while to grow on me but I found through discussions about many aspects of permaculture, and from an animist perspective, we need to encourage life, and encourage interaction between life forms. So, instead of digging, plant some plants that will do it for you, and mulch like the forest does, and encourage digging worms and insects. Save yourself work by delegation. Grow a bunch of clover to help fix nitrogen and feed the deer and rabbits. They will prefer some lovely clover to anything you could be growing in your garden! Plant some alder specifically to thin every year, transport the logs to places on the rest of the land that could use swaling and butressing, and grow some fungi or something as well. Maybe a native willow or two? If you decide to grow anything, double it!!" Ethical Gardening from an Animist Standpoint:

http://tribes.tribe.net/bioregionalanimism/thread/119f7075-4722-4b41-84f7-4236ebadb9fa

“The idea took a while to grow on me but I found through discussions about many aspects of permaculture, and from an animist perspective, we need to encourage life, and encourage interaction between life forms.

So, instead of digging, plant some plants that will do it for you, and mulch like the forest does, and encourage digging worms and insects. Save yourself work by delegation.

Grow a bunch of clover to help fix nitrogen and feed the deer and rabbits. They will prefer some lovely clover to anything you could be growing in your garden! Plant some alder specifically to thin every year, transport the logs to places on the rest of the land that could use swaling and butressing, and grow some fungi or something as well. Maybe a native willow or two? If you decide to grow anything, double it!!”

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By: risa b http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17803 risa b Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:51:55 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17803 Gee, I'm hoping "Meh" in this case means "wow, that was a lot but I'll reread it later and take on my own soil issues." This was an extremely useful post. We're gardening on top of a heavy, unforgiving clay, filled with round river rocks, that has us doing practically everything right in the mulch layer. We bought two tons of hay last year, and are walking back and forth with wheelbarrow loads of poultry bedding, buckets of ashes, liquid manure. When I plant spring crops, I bore a hole in the mulch down to ground level, cloche the spot for a week or two for warm-up, come back, pour in a canful of potting soil, lay out the seeds on that, pour in another canful, tamp it down flat, water lightly, and stick the cloche back in the hole. Things are that bad. On the other hand I haven't had to wrap tons of clay around tiller tines in a long time because I don't till this muck any more (it goes from muck to "bricks without straw" in like, two days) and we DO get crops. So, if we want the land to give us something, we have to put something in first, like our blog author says here ... one thing the soil is not, is a credit default swap. Gee, I’m hoping “Meh” in this case means “wow, that was a lot but I’ll reread it later and take on my own soil issues.” This was an extremely useful post.

We’re gardening on top of a heavy, unforgiving clay, filled with round river rocks, that has us doing practically everything right in the mulch layer. We bought two tons of hay last year, and are walking back and forth with wheelbarrow loads of poultry bedding, buckets of ashes, liquid manure. When I plant spring crops, I bore a hole in the mulch down to ground level, cloche the spot for a week or two for warm-up, come back, pour in a canful of potting soil, lay out the seeds on that, pour in another canful, tamp it down flat, water lightly, and stick the cloche back in the hole. Things are that bad. On the other hand I haven’t had to wrap tons of clay around tiller tines in a long time because I don’t till this muck any more (it goes from muck to “bricks without straw” in like, two days) and we DO get crops.

So, if we want the land to give us something, we have to put something in first, like our blog author says here … one thing the soil is not, is a credit default swap.

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By: Calli http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17802 Calli Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:36:13 +0000 http://sharonastyk.com/2009/02/24/fertile-inquiries-creating-and-sustaining-soil-fertility/#comment-17802 Meh Meh

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